Wayfarers of Veeshan

I'm posting this on behalf of Thunderhart (because I know he won't do it, and if he dies in game, I die in game, so it behooves me to do this).

The last 10 levels or so, it's been glaringly obvious that he's not putting out the damage that we generally would expect of a Warrior. In general, my (necro-hasted) pet does about twice the damage as Thunderhart. Seriously. We're talking about never seeing a crit over 90 and often seeing them much closer to 30, with regular hits being in the 20-30 range at best.

So I hope, through this thread, to put it all together.....forget hit points, forget Armor Class...forget defense at all. For now, how do we get a Warrior to maximize damage output per second? What I'm looking for is any and all links to formulas, programs, theories, strategies, that take ALL variables into account and then I'll try to sift through it all.

Here are the variables that I believe can, and must, be taken into account to compute DPS accurately:

- Warrior Level
- STR
- DEX
- Weapon skills (1HS, 2HS, 1HB, 2HB, Piercing, etc)
- Whether using 2 swords, a 2HS, a sword/shield, etc
- Weapon damage
- Weapon delay
- ATK rating
- Any haste
- Any special warrior "skills" (isn't that some new thing?)
- Procs on the weapon(s)
- Damage Bonuses on the weapon(s)

All advice welcome, and especially from anyone with Warrior expertise.

Drex

P.S. For the record, here's where he is now:

Thunderhart
Warrior
Level 50
Barbarian
STR around 210ish
DEX around 150ish
1HS maxed as is dual wield, for his level
Haste = 22% (SCHW)
Weapons:



I don't know his ATK and don't think he's using any special "warrior skills" (I'm really lost on that note).

_________________
Drexxell , 71st GNecrOMancEr -- Wielder of ()
Druul , 60th Troll Shaman () + Wielder of and
Driss, 51st Dwarf Priestess of Brell Serilis
Dralia, 36th Erudite Enchantress

i dont know much about wars but i know my SK does min. damage with a wep. compaired to others in her group, but dps is not her job ,her job is to get mobs to hit her and not the dps people in the group
maybe wars are the same but are better at getten hit?

_________________
Snowcap lvl 85 High Elf Wiz / 102 park circle , Elm woods

Snowdark lvl 90 Dark Elf SK / 103 park circle , Elm woods

My opionion -- a warrior's job isn't to do as much damage as possible, but to generate as much hate as possible.

This gives healers one target to heal instead of multiple targets, saving them mana, and so they don't have to split attension.

Other classes are there to do more damage with less agro, you're pet, wizards, rangers, rogues, etc.

_________________
-- Mindbender Llaffer Outloud
L70 ENC
<select name=Skills>
<option>78 past 1750
<option>272 from 2100
<option>Jewelry:300+Trophy
<option>Tailoring:259+Geerlok
<option>Pottery:256+Geerlok
<option>Smithing:256+15%
<option>Fletching:254+Geerlok
<option>Baking:252+Geerlok
<option>Brewing:251+Geerlok
<option>Research:202+Geerlok
<option>Alcohol Tolerance:200
<option>Fishing:182
</select>

First, I know very little about it scientifically. I observe and compare in my own little ways.

The first two posts are pretty much correct. Warriors will not be the highest output damage dealers. Warriors are, however the best at taking damage. Agi, hp, and ac are important for their main function.

That being said, I have seen warriors do quite a bit of damage with the right equipment. If your strength and dex are up there decently, and you are still doing very little damage, then upgrade the weapons. Procs are nice to help with agro, though generally they don't add very much to the DPS ( the only exception clerics with their summoned hammers as far as I know ). Aside from faster weapons with higher damage modifiers, haste is the next thing to help. Add new weapons and a higher haste item, or a bard/ chanter/ shaman, to your group and you can see a significant increase in the damage he does, though any similarly equipped rogue/monk/berserker will outdamage him by a large margin.

_________________

70 Bard, at your service
Elder, Wayfarer of Veeshan

Also, , , Irodanise (52 Pal), Irodanes (31 Rog), Iroardanis (19 BL), Sinadori (25 SK), Dreminal (32 Dru)

_________________
Trapped in Veeshan. Send food.

_________________
Drexxell , 71st GNecrOMancEr -- Wielder of ()
Druul , 60th Troll Shaman () + Wielder of and
Driss, 51st Dwarf Priestess of Brell Serilis
Dralia, 36th Erudite Enchantress

weapons that are fast and have effects on them are good. damage is nice, but secondary to delay and a good debuffing proc. That's how I always approached my warrior anyway. A badly overlooked quest is the . It's easy, and few weapons I have owned hold aggro as well as this one does. I have tried the mega expensive and saw no real advantages other than the "look what I got" factor. Of course this is from a retired rogue with a necro alt with a bard alt with a warrior alt so don't take it as the gospel

_________________
Trapped in Veeshan. Send food.

Hate and DPS are not the same thing.

If two people have the same DPS, one swinging with fast one handers, and the other slowly swinging with a high damage 2 hander, the 2-hander isn't going to feel a thing.

Plus Warriors do have hate generating abilities that can be bought at higher levels. they can AE taunt with AAs, etc. even that wimpy normal taunt button adds hate with no additional DPS.

casters have AA abilities available to them (and ENC spells) that can lower the amount of hate generated for their spells (healing, damage, debuffing, etc.) ENC spells when cast on a WAR can increase hate.

Weapons can have procs that add or remove hate as well. (one of the reasons that BoC from AoW goes for 350k - 500k) procs high hate, decent damage for a velious era weapon, and hard to get.

_________________
-- Mindbender Llaffer Outloud
L70 ENC
<select name=Skills>
<option>78 past 1750
<option>272 from 2100
<option>Jewelry:300+Trophy
<option>Tailoring:259+Geerlok
<option>Pottery:256+Geerlok
<option>Smithing:256+15%
<option>Fletching:254+Geerlok
<option>Baking:252+Geerlok
<option>Brewing:251+Geerlok
<option>Research:202+Geerlok
<option>Alcohol Tolerance:200
<option>Fishing:182
</select>

Here's a corollary to what's already been said. I realize, especially with the amount of higher dmg/dly ration weapons floating around now a days, I don't nearly do as much as I should for some at level 59. Still, that doesn't mean I'm not doing my job. A tank's role really is to hold aggro so that the REAL dps doesn't die.

In fact, an interesting thing happened the other night in my group. I had lower hp/ac than the warrior in my group so we let him be tank. Pally chain stuns build hate quickly, and I was unintentionally stealing aggro. Yet since I was busy stunning, I pretty much delivered no damage to the mobs. On the other hand, the warrior was going damage crazy with a slam, 2 1-hs weapons (I forget which ones, but one of them had some sort of damage proc), kick, and whatever else he was doing -I don't even know. The thing was despite the amount of damage he was doing, he was still having trouble holding aggro because he couldn't build enough hate.

What Thunderhart should do is let you do your thing, Drex. I remember Zayphres once told me "...don't bother trying to kill the mob, I can do that. Just make sure they hit you and not me." Warriors have so many aggro building things that they pretty much just need to find ways to build hate.

I don't know anything about crits, but I think crits are on a totally different randomizer than regular hits that gives them an increaed chance at doing more, but not necessarily doing more. Regardless, my thoughts as a tank are that he should forget about damage and go for hate building items (and I wouldn't just be thinking about weapons, some armors have something that can build aggro). Also, I think Necros have a hate increase buff, so that should help too. If he can pick up aggro, the rest of your group can do the rest.

_________________
Expert Artisan Orionpax
Master Alchemist Raznorak
"Til' all are one!" ~Optimus Prime

I agree with Llaffer. The purpose of a warior is to take the hits because in game they have the most HP and AC. Casters and secondary melee far out damage wariors, in my opinion, by far.

_________________


Footprints on the sands of time are not made by sitting down. -Unknown

I don't have a hate increaser (my Enchanter does though), so that's out, but I like the strong advice I'm hearing on this. In general, Thunderhart ALWAYS gets a "thornshield" from Talinoth before wading into battle, as an additional way to "irritate" the mob.

I guess I should be looking at ways to increase HATE then...Orion says stuns do that..yes? Anyone else have favorite buffs/procs that they like to generate aggro with?

_________________
Drexxell , 71st GNecrOMancEr -- Wielder of ()
Druul , 60th Troll Shaman () + Wielder of and
Driss, 51st Dwarf Priestess of Brell Serilis
Dralia, 36th Erudite Enchantress

Well if you want to generate hate LOL take it from a Ranger!!! As a combo When I must tank or I am agro kiting in POV with a all caster group I use

1) Flame Lick (a lvl 9 ranger spell 3 dmg dot, But WOW talk about agro)

2) Tangling weeds, Snare, or Ensare ( lol this one really ticks off the mob)

3) My little Taunt button ( this little guy works wonders after 3 or 4 clicks)

4) My Eartcaller ( Procs a 50% slow, Its a slow nuff said )

With this combination I will bet all the PP in Norrath you well not take agro from me and if you do its because I want you to LOL.

Rangers have 2 terriffic little spells Jolt and Cider jolt. One cast of jolt drops me 700 pts off of the mobs hate list. Its and instant cast and instant recast. 2 or 3 cast the mob tends to forget who I am and chaces down the person next on the hate list

Hopefully the Ranger your in a group/raid knows how to use these spells or his favorite little caster might be next on the hate list and gets wacked.

These this all apply to a Ranger for a Worrior I am uncertin I have never played one.

Personally I would shoot for a good 2 hander attach a hate auggie from ldon (fairly easy to obatian the points for this) and raise Thunderheart Attack high as possible.

_________________
Laldaas Arrowsligger "Retired" 62nd Season
People knew him as the "Mighty Ranger"

"Never Give Up"

What happens if I take both the red and the blue pill at the same time?

_________________
Drexxell , 71st GNecrOMancEr -- Wielder of ()
Druul , 60th Troll Shaman () + Wielder of and
Driss, 51st Dwarf Priestess of Brell Serilis
Dralia, 36th Erudite Enchantress

Yes it is the

_________________
Laldaas Arrowsligger "Retired" 62nd Season
People knew him as the "Mighty Ranger"

"Never Give Up"

What happens if I take both the red and the blue pill at the same time?

There are several augments that can increase hate.

Miragul's - 510pts - Aug4 -
Notlore, Effect:Anger II(combat), Restrictions:1hWeaponsOnly War Primary, Secondary

This one is most atainnable, being a slot 4 and only 510 points.

Guk 1150 Aug8
Lore, Effect:AngerIII, Restrictions:WeaponsOnly All Primary, Secondary

Mir 1150 Aug4
Notlore, Effect:AngerIII, Restrictions:WeaponsOnly War Primary, Secondary

Mmc 510 Aug8 Radiant Sphere of Disgust
Effect:AngerII, Restrictions:WeaponsOnly War Primary, Secondary